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$8,000 First-Time Homebuyer Credit to be Extended for Military
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Yesterday, the House of Representatives voted 416 to 0 to pass the Service Members Home Ownership Tax Act of 2009 which extends the current $8,000 first-time home buyer tax credit for another 12 months for members of the military, Foreign Service, and intelligence corp who served at least three months of qualified overseas duty in 2009. The program is set to expire on November 30th, 2009 for everyone else and the justification for the extension makes sense. If you’ve been serving abroad for our country, it makes it very difficult for you to look for a house and take advantage of the program. Extending it another year certainly makes sense.
At the moment the bill has passed only the House of Representatives, it or a similar bill needs to pass the Senate, then reconciled, then signed by the President before it is law.
“If you are in a conflict zone, you don’t have time to get together with your spouse and family to go house shopping,” says Rep. Ron Kind, a Wisconsin Democrat. Rep. Dave Camp, a Republican from Michigan, expressed similar concerns. “A lot of service members get called overseas at a moment’s notice,” Camp says. “And because of the time limit on the legislation now, they can’t always take advantage of it, not because of anything that they did or didn’t do but because of the unique nature of serving in our armed forces.”
It’s estimated that this will result in an additional 10,000 home sales, likely clustered around military facilities, at no extra cost. It’s revenue neutral because there are other revenue generating provisions included in the bill. The Senate received the bill yesterday and is set to vote on it fairly quickly.
As for the original credit set to expire on November 30th, there are discussions about extending the credit an additional six months.
House Votes to Extend First-Time Home Buyer Tax Credit for Service Members [U.S. News & World Report]
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I really believe this tax credit doesn’t cost the government a dime, long term. People who buy homes they can afford work harder and pay more in income taxes. Also, it should be extended to people who are moving up to a bigger home and not just first time homebuyers. The current program was calculated to cost the government 28 billion. Compared to the size of the stimulus this is next to zero.
If someone is buying a house he can comfortably afford, an $8,000 credit isn’t likely to swing it one way or the other. But it will swing the marginal cases. What this will do (and has done) is to take marginal cases where someone probably shouldn’t buy a home, and put them over the top.
The mortgage crisis was brought on by too much homeownership, frankly. This credit program is the equivalent of having a Bloody Mary to cure a hangover.
The thought that $28 billion is “next to zero” only highlights how large the U.S. government is and how ridiculous government spending has gotten.
And you are right, the tax credit won’t cost the government one dime. Nothing ever costs government anything. It will, however, cost taxpayers $28 billion plus interest.
It is nothing compared to the size of the stimulus and I personally would love to see a credit available to all home buyers, but I don’t think that’s feasible economically.
Personally, I think all military personnel should deserve more than we are giving them. The government needs to do a MUCH better job taking care of our troops once they return from duty i.e. job placement services, guaranteed health care for life, private sector skill training.
I’ve come across too many stories, including my own father in law, who served our country, and seemingly has been forgotten by the government.
With the Blue Angels soaring around here in San Francisco this weekend, we’re reminded about the strength of our country.
What are military personnel doing to deserve more? Especially inactive ones. What makes their job one that deserves perks from anyone and everyone? I don’t get them. Many more dangerous jobs don’t get them. Other government employees don’t get them. What makes military personnel special?
The bill only applies to active military who have spent at least 90+ days overseas. It’s not about the danger, it’s about being away and thus unable to look for a home.
It’s still taking a class, recently active military personnel, and saying they’re better than everyone else. How does giving military personnel an extension help more than giving everyone one? I get that they haven’t been able to look for a house, but they chose the job.
No it doesn’t. It gives that class an an opportunity to take advantage of something they couldn’t because they were deployed. Everyone else, which itself a specialized class anyway because it’s only first time homebuyers, already had the opportunity, over the last year, to take advantage of the credit.
There are a lot of programs available to members of the armed services, such as the GI Bill and favorable VA mortgage loans, that seems to have drawn your ire. Do you feel the same about all programs designed to benefit members of the armed services?
Jim –
What I don’t get is that the tax credit was Jan 1 – Dec 1.
They are extending the credit for people who have been deployed for 90 days because they couldn’t shop for a home? What did they do the other 244 days?
This is akin to people getting support our troops car magnets (that don’t donate money to the military, just profit some Chinese manufacturer of trinkets). It’s only purpose is for people to say “We support the troops!”
MLR
hey scum bag if you want to come fight this war you are more than welcome. No we do not get a chance to find homes when we are deployed. My fiance and I are going through this exact thing right now. She goes to look at homes and then sends me the pictures. Do you really think that is fair? Yes I did chose this job and yes I would die for you and your freedom. One last thing did you know that an average married military soldier qualifies for welfare. Tell me again who is sacrificing!!!
no mission too difficult
no sacrifice too great
DUTY FIRST
Thank you so much for the personal insult, Joe. It serves to undermine your point better than I ever could.
It’s appareent that many people in this forum don’t much about the military way of life. First I want to say the the VA Home loan is not a super great benefit. The only thing it does is allow you to get a house with no money down but it costs you an additional $7000 for the benefit of no money down. I would trade an $8000 benefit in a minute for my VA Home Loan Benefits. Maybe you also don’t know that extensions for many other things have been granted to the military such filing taxes because you are deployed and resolving legal matters since the 1940s. The fact that we chose this profession to protect our country should have bearing on recieveing the same benefits that every other American recieves. No one in the military feel they are better than any other American. To answer your question what makes the military special is that we pay State and Federal Taxes while overseas just like every other American with only limited use government services. Other government employees generally don’t spend 1-3 years away from the USA. Even with the extension some Miltary members still will be able to use the benefit. Overseas assignments can last anywhere from 1-3 years.
wow… i cannot believe that someone in america enjoying the freedoms and liberties that our armed forces has granted u feels as strongly as you do about this… most military members live below the poverty line and have to sacrifice more material things in life than the majority of society just so that they can volunteer to protect our country and your freedom to speech. And for the record, my husband and I began looking for a house when we heard about the credit, found one and began the process when he was called up at a moments notice in april to go serve his 4th deployment, so therefore we were unable to finalize the deal. So no, some military members were not just sitting on their asses but actually unable to take advantage of this credit. I wish scumbags like u had to go over there and see only half the shit they see and loose someone half as close as they do and then come back and tell me they dont deserve every ounce of anything given to them and way more.
You can’t be serious!!! Try having your husband gone in Korea for a year, than less than a year later off in Iraq for 15 months. We missed two of each holidays together with three kids!!! Now he’s gone for another six months for school!!! Do you even know what you are saying???
And that’s entirely his choice. If he didn’t want to do that he wouldn’t have joined the military.
It will all come to bitter sweet end with 20 years in at the age of 39… And the paychecks for the rest of his life!!! Plus benefits!!! Haha!!!
MLR doesn’t understand that very few military members go on deployment for just 90 days. Some go for 6 months, 8 months and some for 18 months. So maybe that can help explain to him what we in the military might have been doing for the remaining 244 days of the year.
In addition, we in the military did choose this job so that everyone, not just us, could enjoy the luxuries and liberties we enjoy on a daily basis here in the USA. The fact that most enlisted military personnel would qualify for welfare should be enough to silence you and squash any argument you have. The extension for military personnel was intended for those gone on deployment for most of the year and unable to devote that time to purchasing a home. Unfortunately it seems that those against giving the military this extension will never understand the sacrifice we make by joining the military to begin with, never see the connection between our service and their quality of life, and obviously don’t understand the notion of service for the good of others.
The bill is for those who have been deployed for 90+ days. So, I was asking, what were those people who were only deployed for 90 days of the year doing?
Yes, if they were gone for 9 months of the year, that is a little different. But why is the bill giving benefits to those who were gone for 3-6 months? Surely 6 months is ample time to shop.
The argument that the military affords us our lifestyles is bunk, to me. Everyone who works does so to afford our country a certain level of luxury. Could the military function without everyone else working or something? If everyone was in the military would we be an amazing land of freedom? In fact, the argument could be made that the military takes away from our maximum level of luxury. How much of my taxes goes towards paying off debt incurred from past and current wars?
We have opposing views, and I’m sure we will never agree with each other on them.
I just wanted to clear up that I do not think all military personnel are deployed for 90 days. I don’t understand why military people who were deployed for a small part of the year are getting this benefit.
It’s great to see that the government is providing military personnel with an extra benefit. They put their life on the line for us everyday and are having their benefits taken away on a daily basis.
The fact is that government is already doing plenty to support home ownership, while simultaneously shooting itself in the foot. The government now controls approximately 90% of all mortgages. And many of the mortgages that the government is now subsidizing are for people who cannot afford a decent down payment. In addition, the Fed is buying trillions of dollars of mortgage debt to keep mortgage rates artificially low. All this is done in an attempt to keep home prices artificially high. In other words, the U.S. government is propping up home prices and giving subsidies to help people afford the higher home prices it has created.
daemondust:
Yes, the military is a volunteer job. But that doesn’t make it any less dangerous, noble, and/or necessary. Because of these people you don’t think deserve these benefits is the reason you are free to have internet access and are free to speak your mind on forums such as these. The military is here to protect you and this beautiful country that we all live in. I am assuming you live in America and wake up every day with the freedom to do what you choose within the confines of our laws. If so, you can thank a soldier or airman for that. This is the reason they have special programs for them. The government realizes how important it is to keep our military happy.
Don’t you think that is a good reason? I know I do.
You live in the greatest country in the world. Thank a soldier or airman for that.
So why not extend it to others? If it’s to repay military families for doing their dangerous job, why not to police and firefighters? They have dangerous jobs too, but aren’t getting this offer.
you, daemondust, are an insult to the United States. I’ll bet you’ve never served anyone but yourself. are you married? probably not. kids? i hope not.
many current policeman and firefighters are former military…and would likely support the extension of the credit. many people above have said this to you but i’ll say it again…it’s NOT about deployment being dangerous…it’s about the DEPLOYMENT. military overseas do not have the time or resources to actively seek out a home and thus take advantage of the home buyers credit. when you understand this concept, maybe you’ll understand that your arguments hold no bearing.
i’m sorry for the loyalty, pride, and happiness you’re missing out on by not supporting our troops.
So I’m an “insult to the United States” because I don’t support your narrow-minded views? You’re pro-military. Fine. That works for you. It doesn’t for me. What happened to the United States welcoming EVERYONE, no matter what their views? Did I miss us becoming a radical military state? I did not ask for the military, nor do I want them.
“many current policeman and firefighters are former military ….” and many are not. This has absolutely no bearing on anything.
“… maybe you’ll understand that your arguments hold no bearing.” Nor does yours.
Wow dude. You’re taking this a little too far. Explain to me how anyone would live in this country -happily- with all the freedoms that we have, without a military?
You would honestly like to live in this country without a military? Could you even comprehend what that would be like?
I don’t know you and I don’t know your background but it sounds as if you have a very negative view of the armed forces in this country. Whatever reason that is, I seriously don’t care, because it is obvious there is no convincing you of the importance of the military in this country(the USA).
Good luck to ya.
daemondust, I’m curious about something. I wonder if you have the intestinal fortitude to answer a few questions so that maybe the rest of us can understand why you see things the way you do.
Are you an only child?
Were you raised in a broken home?
Have any of your family members (siblings or close relations) ever served in the military or in any form of public service?
Do you own your own home now?
Are you a male or female?
Did you vote in the last presidential election?
Would you vote the same way if the election was held today?
What is your general occupational field?
Are you currently employed?
Have you recently been contacted by beings from another solar system?
While I may not say it in the same words that Joe in Iraq does, I completely agree.
@daemondust ~ you will note at the end of the article you are commenting on, there are ongoing discussions about extending the program on a whole another six months. Since the issue for you seems to be that you will not be able to utilize the current benefit.
@MLR ~ You make it sound like our sons/brothers/fathers/uncles are deployed for 90 days and then get to come home. A more likely scenario, if we are lucky, is they are home for 90 days and the remainder of the year is spent deployed. My son has been stateside all of 120 days this year. And he is a Marine….I heard the Army deploys their soldiers for up to 1 year at a time!
My whole argument isn’t anti-military. I’m arguing that it isn’t fair to put one class above another.
My husband deployed in Jan and will be gone for an entire year (may be home 6 months and deploy again…how is that for a fun job?) We just found out the family will relocate upon his return. I think we should be able to take advantage of the tax credit. Not only does the military member make sacrafices for his/her country so does their spouse and their children. We won’t be buying outside of our means, but a 10% credit sure will help make that first time home purchase that much better. Do military deserve “special” treatment…you step into their boots at a deployed location for just a month..not the 6-12 months most are there for and then you repost!
Sacrifices? They chose the job. I’m not in the military because I don’t feel the benefits outweigh the costs. Military don’t deserve special treatment any more than anyone else does. They deserve what they were promised when they signed up; no more. no less. To pretend otherwise is disingenuous.
why everyone talking about sacrifice for the country. I love my country and the people who fought and serving but this about tax credit extend! I think I shoukd be for everyone who is purchasing or wanting to purchase. COme on guys
I agree in extending it for troops that deployed in 2009. especially those that deployed 2008 and won’t be back until December 2009. Then it makes sense since they can’t shop for a house when there not here to do it.
It sounds like some of these people have a grudge against service members. I wonder if they couldn’t get in the military and get the extra benefits they get.
Its great to see that you are extending tax credit for service members. I love my country and the mens and women who either fought and fighting. I lost a couple of friends. I do believe that its showing a side thats not fair to everyone else by extending it only for the service members. We also have hard working people besides the service member who would like to have a place to call home. Mostly all the people I know who were military, there home was foreclose due to leaving or divorce. I think it just a big risk for only them, when there other people who want a home in there hometown. Well its your money govt, do what you do but my opinion it’s not fair. Sorry!
I’m truly amazed at how many people are saying this tax credit should be extended to everyone. Does people even look at the deficit anymore, or do they think it’s all Monopoly money? Being that this is a personal finance blog, I find it amazing that people don’t make the personal finance to government spending comparison. If it’s unwise for the average American to live month-to-month on credit, it is equally as bad (or worse) for the government to do so, since government has to take the money via taxes or inflation to do so. As I said before, this is nothing less than stealing from our children and grandchildren to maintain our currently inflated standard of living.
Not to mention that these subsidies for home buyers are only perpetuating the issues that caused the housing bubble in the first place (pushing home ownership via lax lending standards, easy credit, etc).
I seem to be one of the few that thinks the government is spending way too much taxpayer money (NOT the government’s money) that it doesn’t even have.
For the person who made a comment about “what were soldiers doing for another 244 days…” you show me a soldier who was only deployed for 90 days… I just got back from a 13-month tour in Afghanistan and I was only supposed to be deployed for 12 months. Many other soldiers are extended to up to 15 months. The shortest I have seen in theater was 6 months and that’s for Air Force and Navy because they are on different rotations. So I think this bill is excellent and we, the military, deserve it. I personally want to buy a condo now and take advantage of the 8K bonus, but there is no way I can get the loan, shop for condo, and do the closing in a month. And do you all think military is a special class? Have you checked how much we make? Have you checked how much paramilitary make, or other government contractors? Yes, we have GI Bill and slightly better VA loans but not that much.
If you don’t feel the pay is worth it, then DON’T TAKE THE JOB. It isn’t that hard of a concept. If the pay isn’t enough (and I agree it isn’t, for the job), then that should be fixed. This money was budgeted for the general populace, not military. If it’s earmarked specifically for military, it should come out of the military’s budget.
How sad….if everyone in America only based their vocational decisions on how much money they would make. Personally Im glad I dont live in your America, daemondust. Im grateful for and thank all members of our military that put their lives on the line so we can whine and complain about all our perceived injustices.
And the fund was/is for everyone, not just the military. The extension is for those military that were deployed for more than 90 days. People that were not deployed had an entire year to take advantage of the benefit. Deployed military members did not. Bottom line.
So if I work 80+ hours a week at civilian jobs and can’t find the time to look for and purchase a house, that’s my problem. But if I’m deployed in the military suddenly it’s not?
If you work 80+ hours a week at a civilian job, how would you plan on buying a house anyway?
So someone who works 80 hours a week doesn’t need a house? Where am I supposed to stay the other 88 hours a week?
daemondust: you are forgetting that the main idea behind the program is that it allows soldiers that were deployed when the law was passed, to take advantage of it. which I think it totally fair. I understand there is a lot of people who still want to take advantage of this program, and hopefully w new bill will be passed to benefit them. A lot people took advantage of this program while it was available to them. And those who didn’t probably have thousands reasons why not. The main point, deployed soldiers could not participate of this program, and people who where could.
What makes their one reason so much more important than everyone else’s? I’m not saying military members should be denied access to it, I’m saying everyone should get an extension, or no one should.
Some interesting data provided by the Brookings Institute (via Barrons) regarding the various home buyer programs:
“[E]ach additional home sale generated by the $8,000 first-time homebuyers’ tax credit actually costs the government $43,000″ and up to $292,000 if a $15,000 credit is extended to all homebuyers.
http://online.barrons.com/article/SB125609957458798391.html
All I can say to this entire post is…Wow! I appreciate all of the men and women who serve our great country. I myself serve and will contuinue to do so. I chose to. I chose to serve and be apart of something greater than myself. From the very beginnings of this great nation there were foot soldiers who fought for what they believed in. Some veiws were warped, and some not. Yet, they fought and we became this great nation and continue to evolve. The thing that pushed them was the thought that everyone has a right to their beliefs, safety, and above all freedom. Daemondust has a right to his opinion. I will admit that it is a bit warped. Yet, on the other hand, that is what we are fighting for. His opinion, mine, and yours.
It doesn’t matter how we agree or disagree. Sometimes others will not see the answer behind the “why” that is so apparent to many others. I accept it, and also choose not to agree to the military being is being treated better than any other american with this new development. As others have states, legislation is being looked at to extend this credit for all. I have no issues with this. It is a great opportunity.
My mind wonders. If it is such an injustice for a good friend of mine (who deployed in March and will not return until May 2010) to get a little more time with his family in order to take advantage of this program, then I would have to say that it is a sad day. Never mind the fact that before or after any deployment there is usually a 1 to 3 month mobilization or demobilization. There is training and there are schools that range from 3 weeks to 6 months that aren’t always located in the town where you will be deploying from. Quite often its located on the other side of the country. Many do not realize that a deployment, no matter how short, can have a significant financial impact on a family. Sometimes that impact isn’t financial. It could be related to finances, child care issues, elderly family members. Many question who’s going to watch my children? Am I going to have to set my mother up in a nursing home until I return. All of these things can have a big impact on the when and how a family, military or civilian, will handle searching for a home after a deployment. Sometimes a deployment isn’t in the mix. I have another good friend who just got orders sending her back stateside from korea in february, only to land and get orders less than two months to hawaii. I don’t think she will be able to afford a home in hawaii on her salary and she may not be able to take advatage of the credit at all since her tour will be 36 months. There are many factors that may have influenced the decision to extend the timing for military members and civilians who support various missions. The two examples I have show listed are a nicer shade of why there may be such a broad reach for service members. However, I will not deprive daemondust of his opinion, special class and all. I will think of him, my family and everyone else as I continue to serve, and deploy like many other americans, not special classmen, before me.
Yes, actually, I do have a problem with a lot of those programs. What makes military personnel special? They chose the job, they weren’t forced into it. Yes, it’s dangerous, and yes, they have to be away from home for long periods of time, but a lot of other jobs have exactly the same problems but don’t get those benefits.
Don’t misunderstand me, they are doing a service to the country, but I don’t see anything that makes their sacrifice so much more than anyone else’s.
If things were different and they were forced into it, i.e. drafted, then I would be all for compensating them in ways like this. But they weren’t. They chose the job.
Why not extend this benefit to everyone? Even just everyone in the original class? I wasn’t looking for a house when it was first introduced, but financially I’m in a place where I will be soon. Why does it expire for me Nov 30, and these special people have another year? It was their choice to enter a job where they would likely be away for extended periods of time.
daemondust, I began a response that ended up running into a short novel. So I posted it on my blog: Should Military Members Receive Special Benefits?
As a disclaimer I will note that I am a military veteran and my response is colored based on my first hand experiences. However, I wrote the article based on the assumption that the average reader would not know or understand much about military compensation, which is a complicated topic.
I will wrap it up with the last two lines from the article: “On the whole, I think the program does a good job of giving military members the opportunity to live a comfortable, but not extravagant life. And I don’t think that is too much to ask.”
I totally agree with you. I love you guys for serving my country but what about us hardworking 9-5 people who want to buy and have to be rush because of deadline. It should be extend to everyone!
Dear daemondust,
I respect your right to express yourself. Now I’ll exercise my right to express myself. I think you are missing two very key elements of military service that justify military members and veterans receiving what they’ve earned. #1 – When a person joins the military, they forego their civilian rights and are subject to the UCMJ… not exactly the same set of protections and justice civilians enjoy. #2 – This is probably the most important… their sacrifice (as you put it) is they might ACTUALLY DIE in the course of DEFENDING IDIOTS LIKE YOU so you can protest their meager existence. Walk a mile in a military member’s boots before you start complaining about what little they get for the huge service they provide to not just Americans but people around the globe.
Signed,
Steve Logsdon
Sgt. USMC 1976-1980
“Don’t misunderstand me, they are doing a service to the country, but I don’t see anything that makes their sacrifice so much more than anyone else’s.”
In one sentence, this sacrifice is that miltary don’t do their job for a paycheck, health benefit or retirement plan but for the greater good of bringing safety and freedom back home for EVERY American.
Can you say that about your job? I can’t about mine.
Thank you for copying my comment wholesale and posting it, without my permission or any attribution, on your own blog. I really do appreciate the the copyright infringement.
You do have some good points, but you fail to see mine. I’m not arguing that service members shouldn’t receive an extension, I’m arguing that EVERYone should. To argue that military service should let you play by different rules is absurd.
daemondust, the comment to attributed to you, but I did not infringe your copyright. Please see the Blueprint Comment Policy.
“License. By posting a comment on Blueprint for Financial Prosperity, you grant JW Enterprises, LLC an irrevocable license to use, display, republish, sell, alter, or delete your comment in any way and for any reason.”
Should Jim wish me to remove the portion of the comment I quoted on my site, I will do so.
I don’t fail to see your point. I disagree with your point – there is a difference.
There are currently discussions to extend the provision 6 months for everyone. Is giving military members an additional 6 months beyond that really a big deal?
Military members receive a multitude of benefits that civilians never receive, including an extension on taxes when they are in a war zone or otherwise out of the country on military orders. Should the same extension be given to everyone even though they had time to file their taxes because they were living in the US and not living out of a tent in the middle of the desert? Should all other military benefits be removed because civilians don’t receive them?
There are a multitude of special interest groups receiving a variety of benefits that aren’t available to everyone. The military should not be singled out.
I won’t try to change your mind and I don’t wish to extend this conversation further. Feel free to have the last word.
Actually, you did infringe my copyright. Nowhere did I transfer copyright on my post, therefore it’s mine. I did not grant JW Enterprises, LLC an exclusive license to it, so I can republish it wherever I chose. I did not, however, grant you any such license. You have absolutely no right to copy my work, short though it may be, without my permission, just as I can’t take your work.
If the original bill included this provision, then fine. But it didn’t. If it’s going to be extended it should be extended for everyone, not a specific class.
All I can say for you is “Bring on the draft!!!!” Most members of the military join because they believe they need to serve our country. Yes, they do choose to. But what you are forgetting is that because they make that choice, it allows YOU to make the choice NOT to! Remember that!
You are a true MORON. Public domain blogs do not carry copyright protection. Get a life before you lose the pathetic one you now have.
While I’m a huge supporter of our troops, I’m not sure forcing people to get shot at is the most effective way of expanding liberty/freedom.
Keep in mind that programs such as this one only provide additional incentive to join an already bloated military. If the US didn’t feel the need to keep troops in virtually every corner of the globe, only a fraction of our current military personnel would truly be necessary. In other words, a smaller military wouldn’t mean that Joe Sixpack would have to pick up a gun to “defend the US” in some random country. It would mean that the US government would have to think twice before putting our troops in harms way.
I can’t believe I stumbled onto so many selfish, ignorant people as I’ve seen on this blog as it relates to the military and their “perks”; like receiving and extension on the home buying credit. YOu should thank your lucky stars that so many of our young men and women VOLUNTEER to defend and protect the rest of us. Because if they didn’t then YOU and others like you would be DRAFTED and not given much choice about defending the USA. Fine, you don’t like the program, move to another country. I hear there’s plenty of open spaces and very few troops in the mountains of Afghanistan. America… Love it or leave it. End of story!!!
I’m a moron, you say? I think you need to re-read your copyright laws. Every work has copyright. Nowhere did I grant anyone but JW Enterprises, LLC a license to reproduce my work. Further, nowhere in my license to JW Enterprises, LLC do I give permission to transfer or re-license my work. Therefore, anyone else who copies my work has violated my copyright. Just because you think it doesn’t apply, doesn’t mean you’re right.
Can something please be done about the personal insults directed at me in this article? I do not appreciate being abused, especially by people professing to be defending my rights.
Saying “Get a life before you lose the pathetic one you now have.” could VERY easily be construed as threats and intimidation. I do NOT appreciate your abuse.
So I have to support the military or move? Hmm… here I was thinking I was free to say and think whatever I want as long as I don’t infringe on the rights of others. I guess I was wrong. I’m sorry. I’m sure Canada will willingly take me.
But seriously, I would sooner leave the country or sit in prison than be drafted. Your desire to kill others does not nullify my religious objections to war.
daemondust, You can take my comments any way you like. And I could care less if you don’t appreciate my ‘abuse’. The bottom line is that you have what you have (freedom to voice your opinion no matter how anally retentive it is) because men and women like myself, my son, my Dad, my brother, my Uncles, and my nephews have made that sacrifice that you so vehemently despise. You don’t have to like the military, but as Jack Nicholson so eloquently stated in the movie “A Few Good Men”… ” … my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives. You don’t want the truth because deep down in places you don’t talk about at parties, you want me on that wall, you need me on that wall. We use words like honor, code, loyalty. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand a post. Either way, I don’t give a damn what you think you are entitled to.”
So, as you leave the country, don’t let the door hit you in your hind quarters. I wouldn’t want you to bruise your brain!
I don’t believe that argument for a minute. What ’safety’ has the military brought us? Nearly the entire world hating us? Yep, that’s safe. Attacking sovereign nations? Yep, that makes us so much more safe too. Oh, I’ve got it! Finding, and bringing to justice, the people who attacked our country eight years ago. Nope, they haven’t done that one either. If anything, they’ve brought more enmity against us.
What safety are you talking about?