Comments on: Dealers Use Black Book Pricing Information

By: trae

trae — Fri, 11 Nov 2011 15:55:00 +0000

KBB and NADA are retail price guides for the public. Black book is an auction price guide. You can spend all the money to get your dealer license and start a business, then you will have access to the dealer only auction. A dealer compares your trade to what they can buy it for at auction price. This is how they make a profit and stay in business. When did profit become such a bad thing? Do you think grocery and other retailers sell stuff for what they have in it? Come on…. As long as the price is fair, and the customer does his homework to see if the deal is acceptable to him, then everybody wins!

By: dad

dad — Thu, 06 Oct 2011 19:28:03 +0000

your so stupid, i thought i raised you better kid

By: Dealers are Thieves

Dealers are Thieves — Tue, 13 Sep 2011 00:49:51 +0000

That is why dealerships should be eliminated entirely. Consumers should customize and purchase their vehicles directly on-line from the manufacturers. I’d be willing to wait a few weeks or month for delivery to save thousands on a vehicle. It may raise the unemployment rate short-term but it will encourage these high-school educated “car salesmen” to aspire to be something more than just a swindler.

By: mike

mike — Sat, 20 Aug 2011 21:51:42 +0000

you are full of it. if you want to get the best price..buying..or selling..get a friend who has the weekly black book…get the price of the car you want to buy or sell..and give the dealer a reasonable profit. 500 to 1,000 dollars based on how bad you want to buy and how bad you think he wants to sell.

this is the only way to buy or sell a used car.

what you learn from the black book..is what a dealer has in a used car. and you will learn what a wholesaler will give him for your car. the price you will come up with, will often be thousands less than what you thought was a “good deal”. make him the offer. accept no negotiation. go home if you have to. that dealer..will call you back. because..500 to 1000 profit..is better than no profit..and these guys want inventory off their lot!

By: MK

MK — Mon, 04 Jul 2011 21:29:47 +0000

A “new” trick….I was at a dealer Saturday. They checked my trade…wrote up a deal…MSRP – trade – rebate = xxx

I asked “where is the discount on the new vehicle”?

Oh, its in the trade…They showed me auction numbers and Black Book. Black Book showed my vehicle worth 6800. I went home, got on line, found website that linked directly to black book..punched in my vehicle stats…result? $10,000. I went to KBB, $11500 ( good condition)…oh and they didnt even drive my vehicle to check it out, like they used to.

People are tired of the games. Paying under wholesale ( or even wholesale) and selling full retail? Thats why GM needed Government money bailout. People will just keep their cars 10 years now….then go and by used from person, not dealer. Saves 10″s of thousands over a lifetime.

By: Lee

Lee — Tue, 21 Jun 2011 19:17:03 +0000

They don’t even get close to Black Book. Black Book on my truck is 46k as it sits in pristine condition with all of 13k miles on it KBB is 48k. The dealers are offering me 37 to 38k for the truck. It is all one huge rip-off, that is why I despise car dealers, most are liars crooks and cheats.

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Wed, 01 Jun 2011 14:50:02 +0000

It wasn’t like that at one time. They used to give the KBB value for a trade in.

By: Weareallnuts

Weareallnuts — Mon, 30 May 2011 19:34:31 +0000

I am positive that dealers never leave used cars on there lots for more than 60 days. They want people to see that they rare having a big turn over. The manufactures are always lowering prices to the Dealers so they will lower prices to the customers. The dealer again as in most will take the money in parts and turn around and sell them at a big profit which is maybe 100% and more than what the money would have been. I was at a dealer to buy a car. Started out with 3000 trade allowance. NO WAY OK we settled on 5000 which was not what I had started out at but it was a compromise. He is off to get some figures as far as payments interest was 1.9% or 1000 cash. I had already been to my credit Union and there rates was 1.9% also. I made a mistake I said for get about Using your bank I’ll take the 1000 I have the same rate at my bank. When he comes back now I now have a 4200 allowance for my car. Then there was a fee to make more profit of $900 for prep and documentation and there is a sales tax on the $900. Car started at 30,900 less trade 1000 then tax and title there extras it now was costing as much as it was when I started out. I was so PISSED I walked out I don’t need a new car that bad. I felt like I was flying on an airplane being nicked and dimmed everywhere they can. I have no problem with them making money. SOMEHOW somebody forgot that sales man are paid commission not by the hour. I am sorry I spent 6 hours with the sales men to walk out on him. I think my time is valuable also.
Whatarewenuts

By: Johnny2tone

Johnny2tone — Fri, 22 Apr 2011 16:18:09 +0000

$4,000 under & $4,000 over = $8,000 typical spread where I live. Dealers are entitled to profit, but if they would quit their stupid remarks and “free floor mat” tactics, I dont mind giving it to them as they are are in biz for profit and do not need to apologize for such – Just dont earn it all on 1 deal.

I had a guy (after I fully decided to purchase a dodge minivan in 2000) tell me “yeah, it’s the sport – its got the Viper front end”. I almost walked right then but needed the van….

By: ozzy

ozzy — Fri, 18 Mar 2011 04:30:06 +0000

Hey tom ^. I understand your gripe, I deal with cars but not as a licensed dealer. As far as what I have come to know, Black Book projects what the car will be worth in 12-36 months. Dealers must account for the asset sitting on the lot with money tied up. That is the only way I could understand such a price discrepancy of $4000. Thats like 20%+ off. It doesn’t make sense. I am almost ready to move to next level and become a dealer. What scares me the most, is hardening my heart.

By: ted

ted — Thu, 13 Jan 2011 18:50:49 +0000

So how do you think car dealers pay their employees? Out of profits of course…No dealer could stay in business offering blackbook prices..

By: Tom

Tom — Mon, 19 Jul 2010 09:00:57 +0000

I decided to sell my one owner fully loaded BMW 330xi. so I called up my friend who lives in a different state and has a dealer licence. I live in D.C. area

According to auction data, last week cars similar to mine with higher milage were selling for around 20,000, country wide.

Blue book trade in value for a car in good condition at that time was $22,000. NADA – $21,500

I visited several dealerships. All of them used Black Book to appraise my car. Non of them offered me more than $16,000. $4000 less below wholesale value.

Also, only one of them had 330xi in stock. It had less options and higher milage than mine. Sticker price on that car was above $25,000 (same as KBB value). I know it is a retail price, but the dealer is not goin to take more than $2000 off it.

They’ll spend about $500 maximum to prepare my car for sale (if they will do everything right. In area where I leave almost nobody does). For smart guys who will argue this number – I know common steps of prep work and how much it cost to the dealership to prepare a car that does not need any mechanical or body repair. Mine was fully serviced and professionaly detailed 2 days before I started selling it. It did not need any mechanical atention.

Do the numbers and you’ll see that in worst case for a dealer, they would be making $6,500 profit of $23,000 car. It is more than %30. I am sure they will cover interst cost by adding some “prep and delivery” fee and such.

As somebody already said here, KBB, Edmunds, NADA were created as a reference for both, to a consumer and to a dealer. The Black Book, on other hand, is created to only maximize dealers profit only.

Before they came up with a black book, in D.C. area a general manager at a luxury car dealership on average was making $400,000 – $600,000 a year

P.S.
Greed is a very destructive thing that adventualy brings huge demage to a business and to the country as whole. We are experiencing example of it right now.

By: Bryon

Bryon — Thu, 24 Jun 2010 15:58:53 +0000

The dealers that use the Black Book at auctions are paying more than what NADA average trade says it’s worth. Most of them don’t even look the vehicle over very well and have no mechanical ability at all to know if it has any problems. If you use a Black Book and pay what it says is clean or extra clean wholesale value…guess what…you just paid what NADA has for a retail value. I am a used car dealer with a small lot, and go to 5 to 6 auctions a week. I use NADA so I don’t pay to much for the vehicle. Every day I got to an auction I see dealers paying more for a vehicle than what I have sold them for to a retail customer. Every vehicle on my lot is priced well below NADA retail value. Most of the time if you look up your vehicle and compare NADA to KBB, the value is greater on KBB. The biggest thing you have to watch out for is the interest rate they charge you and all their extra fees. Check with your bank or credit union first to see what kind of rate you can get and take it to a mechanic you trust to look it over before you buy it.

By: jimmy Bean

jimmy Bean — Mon, 21 Jun 2010 01:30:36 +0000

Okay I have reviewed the blackbook and found it to be trash. I have understand their goal and they need to understand my goal. They are there to make money for the dealership and I am there to get the best deal. But we can never meet in the middle.

By: Daniel

Daniel — Thu, 29 Apr 2010 18:15:38 +0000

One last point, as it was slightly foggy when i wrote it. The Black Book used in a specific state is different from the Black Book used in other states. There are individual “state” editions of Black Book weekly. So, there is a Black Book Florida edition. Also, there is no 1 black book either, there’s numerous “black books”. A truck/van/suv guide, which is NOT state based, but regionally based. A monthly book used by financial lenders, it includes retail/wholesale..but NOT xcln values. Then, there’s the weekly car guide. At the end of the day, dealerships use two things.. Black Book and Maheim Market Reports. MMR is unique in that it can “predict” the future value of a car. Honestly, if you can sneak a way to get Black Book, the numbers will be similar as Black Book values are mostly taken from MMR’s and some from Adessa.