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	<title>Comments on: Overdraft Protection Is A Good Thing</title>
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	<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html</link>
	<description>personal finance blog with anecdotes, advice and commentary.</description>
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		<title>By: Bryan</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-364568</link>
		<dc:creator>Bryan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Feb 2011 14:10:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-364568</guid>
		<description>There are a couple reasons - sure the merchant thing is valid, but, specific to checking accounts there are a couple hurdles.  First, regardless how fast items clear, if someone sends a check out with no funds, it&#039;s gonna be an overdraft or bounced check fee (depends if they pay it).

As far as deposited checks becoming available, it&#039;s not just the validity of the funds that matters, but whether it&#039;s a legitimate check.  There is so much fraud these days, that if a system were in place that Bank A could pull immediate funds from Bank B when you deposit a check from Bank B, if that check turned out to be counterfeit but the account it was drawn on actually did have funds, then Bank B would be at MORE risk losing money than under the current system.  Verifying that funds are there does NOT verify that the check was actually written and authorized by the owner of said account.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are a couple reasons &#8211; sure the merchant thing is valid, but, specific to checking accounts there are a couple hurdles.  First, regardless how fast items clear, if someone sends a check out with no funds, it&#8217;s gonna be an overdraft or bounced check fee (depends if they pay it).</p>
<p>As far as deposited checks becoming available, it&#8217;s not just the validity of the funds that matters, but whether it&#8217;s a legitimate check.  There is so much fraud these days, that if a system were in place that Bank A could pull immediate funds from Bank B when you deposit a check from Bank B, if that check turned out to be counterfeit but the account it was drawn on actually did have funds, then Bank B would be at MORE risk losing money than under the current system.  Verifying that funds are there does NOT verify that the check was actually written and authorized by the owner of said account.</p>
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		<title>By: Jake</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-352668</link>
		<dc:creator>Jake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Aug 2010 21:21:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-352668</guid>
		<description>The problem was the sneaky way the banks charged overdraft fees and that fact that no banks allowed you to opt out before the law went into effect.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problem was the sneaky way the banks charged overdraft fees and that fact that no banks allowed you to opt out before the law went into effect.</p>
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		<title>By: Shirley</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-347661</link>
		<dc:creator>Shirley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jun 2010 13:47:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-347661</guid>
		<description>&quot;Who the heck writes checks today anyway? Why is that such a big deal??!&quot;

Although I write very few checks, I will write one to (for instance) the local handyman who comes by to fix a plumbing problem. He doesn&#039;t have the capability to accept CC or debit card and the check is my proof of payment and dated receipt.

Many instances like this need to be paid by check rather than cash.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Who the heck writes checks today anyway? Why is that such a big deal??!&#8221;</p>
<p>Although I write very few checks, I will write one to (for instance) the local handyman who comes by to fix a plumbing problem. He doesn&#8217;t have the capability to accept CC or debit card and the check is my proof of payment and dated receipt.</p>
<p>Many instances like this need to be paid by check rather than cash.</p>
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		<title>By: JimmyDaGeek</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-347560</link>
		<dc:creator>JimmyDaGeek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jun 2010 22:23:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-347560</guid>
		<description>&quot;Some people really are too busy.&quot;

Don&#039;t you expect people who drive a car to pay attention to traffic, or do you let them go where they want to go, at any speed, without signalling, with out learning how to operate a car? I suppose it&#039;s OK if they&#039;re too busy shaving or putting on makeup or texting.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Some people really are too busy.&#8221;</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t you expect people who drive a car to pay attention to traffic, or do you let them go where they want to go, at any speed, without signalling, with out learning how to operate a car? I suppose it&#8217;s OK if they&#8217;re too busy shaving or putting on makeup or texting.</p>
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		<title>By: DaveS</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-347368</link>
		<dc:creator>DaveS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jun 2010 05:48:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-347368</guid>
		<description>um. the issue isn&#039;t about overdraft coverage for a check; it&#039;s about authorizing overdraft fees to cover a debit charge. So, lets say you fill up at the gas station and you choose to pay with your Chase debit card. The $45.00 debit would not transact if you didn&#039;t have the funds to cover it. This would give you the option to switch cards or pay cash. What the banks want to do is authorize this charge of $45.00, and charge you an overdraft coverage fee of $29.00 and voila, you got your gas without getting a declination of approval.

Who the heck writes checks today anyway? Why is that such a big deal??! I&#039;d rather a debit get declined rather than processed. I get emails anyway.

That reminds me.. I forgot to pay a bill. My fault. Damn.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>um. the issue isn&#8217;t about overdraft coverage for a check; it&#8217;s about authorizing overdraft fees to cover a debit charge. So, lets say you fill up at the gas station and you choose to pay with your Chase debit card. The $45.00 debit would not transact if you didn&#8217;t have the funds to cover it. This would give you the option to switch cards or pay cash. What the banks want to do is authorize this charge of $45.00, and charge you an overdraft coverage fee of $29.00 and voila, you got your gas without getting a declination of approval.</p>
<p>Who the heck writes checks today anyway? Why is that such a big deal??! I&#8217;d rather a debit get declined rather than processed. I get emails anyway.</p>
<p>That reminds me.. I forgot to pay a bill. My fault. Damn.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom S</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-347134</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jun 2010 03:02:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-347134</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t know about your bank, but I know at Old National, even if you opt out, you still will get overdraft fees.  The only bank I&#039;ve ever seen it done right at is the Bank of America CashPay cards and ING Direct.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know about your bank, but I know at Old National, even if you opt out, you still will get overdraft fees.  The only bank I&#8217;ve ever seen it done right at is the Bank of America CashPay cards and ING Direct.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom S</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-347133</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jun 2010 02:57:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-347133</guid>
		<description>I wouldn&#039;t call that an insult, but an observation.  Some people do in fact pay more attention to their balance than others, for whatever reason.  But does that give them some sort of right to tell others they should do the same or they are a bad person?

Some people really are too busy.  The poor especially.  Just a week ago, someone I know who is struggling, who trusted the ATM balance, basically just lost their next paycheck due to overdraft fees. (They have 2 jobs, at Fed Ex and with the Census.)  That&#039;s huge, and it&#039;s not funny.  There are very real reasons why the poor do not trust banks.

Where is the social outrage?  Simply put, most people who can do anything about it don&#039;t care.  Most reader of this blog just seem so smug that they are oh so clever and it&#039;s not happening to them. The current system is disgusting and anyone who says otherwise is simply naive to the breadth and depth of the unfairness.

As for myself, all I can say is that I&#039;ve never overdrafted as much as when I was in grad school. You figure that one out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wouldn&#8217;t call that an insult, but an observation.  Some people do in fact pay more attention to their balance than others, for whatever reason.  But does that give them some sort of right to tell others they should do the same or they are a bad person?</p>
<p>Some people really are too busy.  The poor especially.  Just a week ago, someone I know who is struggling, who trusted the ATM balance, basically just lost their next paycheck due to overdraft fees. (They have 2 jobs, at Fed Ex and with the Census.)  That&#8217;s huge, and it&#8217;s not funny.  There are very real reasons why the poor do not trust banks.</p>
<p>Where is the social outrage?  Simply put, most people who can do anything about it don&#8217;t care.  Most reader of this blog just seem so smug that they are oh so clever and it&#8217;s not happening to them. The current system is disgusting and anyone who says otherwise is simply naive to the breadth and depth of the unfairness.</p>
<p>As for myself, all I can say is that I&#8217;ve never overdrafted as much as when I was in grad school. You figure that one out.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom S</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-347132</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jun 2010 02:37:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-347132</guid>
		<description>These alerts are supposed to be a courtesy.  The bank won&#039;t know if you&#039;ll deposit or not, but that doesn&#039;t matter.  They could still alert you to the danger in time so that you can deposit.  A message a day later saying &quot;Gotcha&quot;, only helps the bank.

$35 per item has no basis in real life costs to the bank.  It has no relevance to transaction costs or assuming risks.  I understand that there is a cost, but the current method for calculating it is insane.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>These alerts are supposed to be a courtesy.  The bank won&#8217;t know if you&#8217;ll deposit or not, but that doesn&#8217;t matter.  They could still alert you to the danger in time so that you can deposit.  A message a day later saying &#8220;Gotcha&#8221;, only helps the bank.</p>
<p>$35 per item has no basis in real life costs to the bank.  It has no relevance to transaction costs or assuming risks.  I understand that there is a cost, but the current method for calculating it is insane.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom S</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-347131</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jun 2010 02:25:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-347131</guid>
		<description>Trust me, the technology is there.  Furthermore, I am aware of how the system works, what I am saying is that the system is unfair.  Would you still have the same argument if it was $100 or a $1000 fee?  Where does $35 come from?  It&#039;s not from any sort of economic damage to the bank.  I&#039;m all for paying a penalty, but it should be a fair penalty.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Trust me, the technology is there.  Furthermore, I am aware of how the system works, what I am saying is that the system is unfair.  Would you still have the same argument if it was $100 or a $1000 fee?  Where does $35 come from?  It&#8217;s not from any sort of economic damage to the bank.  I&#8217;m all for paying a penalty, but it should be a fair penalty.</p>
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		<title>By: primerspawn</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-347073</link>
		<dc:creator>primerspawn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Jun 2010 14:29:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-347073</guid>
		<description>why pay overdrafts at all? banks have a little known clause known as OPTION IN, or option out as you would have it, making you nearly impervious to check bouncing. sign a piece of paper and your done with overdrafts all-together. and far as being &#039;at fault&#039; with over-the-limit fees in credit cards and such, we should be careful not to adhere ourselves too closely in language they&#039;ve created outlining a completely irresponsible, unethical and predatory process that they&#039;ve created for maximizing profits</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>why pay overdrafts at all? banks have a little known clause known as OPTION IN, or option out as you would have it, making you nearly impervious to check bouncing. sign a piece of paper and your done with overdrafts all-together. and far as being &#8216;at fault&#8217; with over-the-limit fees in credit cards and such, we should be careful not to adhere ourselves too closely in language they&#8217;ve created outlining a completely irresponsible, unethical and predatory process that they&#8217;ve created for maximizing profits</p>
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		<title>By: ij</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-346733</link>
		<dc:creator>ij</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jun 2010 17:53:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-346733</guid>
		<description>..bottom line is a person should not spend more than he has and be responsible.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>..bottom line is a person should not spend more than he has and be responsible.</p>
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		<title>By: Erica</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-338935</link>
		<dc:creator>Erica</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Feb 2010 01:47:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-338935</guid>
		<description>I use a credit card for my daily expenses, based on a budget I&#039;ve worked out of how much money I should spend from paycheck to paycheck.  I keep track of how much I&#039;ve spent by making a note on my cell phone, since it&#039;s pretty much always with me.  Budget amount. Amount spent. Amount left to spend.

I have an Excel spreadsheet with my account balances.  It gets updated mostly on paydays, which is also when I pay most of my bills.  Again: Account Balance. Money allocated towards expenses.  Amount left over.  It doesn&#039;t matter how long something takes to officially hit my account, because my Excel balance is always accurate.

I really feel it all comes down to personal responsibility.  Does that mean the fees the bank charges are &quot;fair&quot;? Perhaps, not. The interest rates on credit card balances aren&#039;t &quot;fair&quot; either.  There are on ton of things in life that are set up to take advantage of people who either don&#039;t care enough or aren&#039;t educated enough to protect themselves.  Our legal system attempts to rein in the most egregious examples, but for the most part, the childhood axiom that &quot;Life isn&#039;t fair&quot; holds true.

In saying that, probably the most important thing is educating people on how to manage their finances.  I spent several weeks in a high school health class planning and budgeting for an imaginary wedding.  Could that time have been better spent discussing daily budgeting and learning basic financial skills that could I could apply for the rest of my life? Probably.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I use a credit card for my daily expenses, based on a budget I&#8217;ve worked out of how much money I should spend from paycheck to paycheck.  I keep track of how much I&#8217;ve spent by making a note on my cell phone, since it&#8217;s pretty much always with me.  Budget amount. Amount spent. Amount left to spend.</p>
<p>I have an Excel spreadsheet with my account balances.  It gets updated mostly on paydays, which is also when I pay most of my bills.  Again: Account Balance. Money allocated towards expenses.  Amount left over.  It doesn&#8217;t matter how long something takes to officially hit my account, because my Excel balance is always accurate.</p>
<p>I really feel it all comes down to personal responsibility.  Does that mean the fees the bank charges are &#8220;fair&#8221;? Perhaps, not. The interest rates on credit card balances aren&#8217;t &#8220;fair&#8221; either.  There are on ton of things in life that are set up to take advantage of people who either don&#8217;t care enough or aren&#8217;t educated enough to protect themselves.  Our legal system attempts to rein in the most egregious examples, but for the most part, the childhood axiom that &#8220;Life isn&#8217;t fair&#8221; holds true.</p>
<p>In saying that, probably the most important thing is educating people on how to manage their finances.  I spent several weeks in a high school health class planning and budgeting for an imaginary wedding.  Could that time have been better spent discussing daily budgeting and learning basic financial skills that could I could apply for the rest of my life? Probably.</p>
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		<title>By: NateUVM</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-337331</link>
		<dc:creator>NateUVM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Feb 2010 14:03:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-337331</guid>
		<description>Or, if you&#039;re trying to avoid the trap of running too much up on a credit card, how about a charge card that HAS to be paid off each month?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Or, if you&#8217;re trying to avoid the trap of running too much up on a credit card, how about a charge card that HAS to be paid off each month?</p>
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		<title>By: govenar</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-336875</link>
		<dc:creator>govenar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Jan 2010 22:42:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-336875</guid>
		<description>You don&#039;t need to know your exact checking account balance at all times, like when you&#039;re out shopping.  The only time I need to know my balance is when I&#039;m at my computer paying a bill online or writing a check for rent; if I&#039;m at my computer, it&#039;s very easy to check my exact balance.

Maybe the problem is that you&#039;re using a debit card.  Just use a credit card.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You don&#8217;t need to know your exact checking account balance at all times, like when you&#8217;re out shopping.  The only time I need to know my balance is when I&#8217;m at my computer paying a bill online or writing a check for rent; if I&#8217;m at my computer, it&#8217;s very easy to check my exact balance.</p>
<p>Maybe the problem is that you&#8217;re using a debit card.  Just use a credit card.</p>
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		<title>By: govenar</title>
		<link>http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/overdraft-protection-is-a-good-thing.html/comment-page-1#comment-336873</link>
		<dc:creator>govenar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Jan 2010 22:33:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bargaineering.com/articles/?p=5716#comment-336873</guid>
		<description>ING Electric Orange actually requires the overdraft line of credit, it&#039;s not optional (at least, as of a couple months ago).  So they always do a hard credit inquiry.

I agree with the part about doing a hard inquiry for overdraft... though even then, they could wait until you actually make use of the overdraft.  I think banks like to do hard inquiries because they also offer mortgages; if they can artificially lower your credit score, they can charge you higher interest on a mortgage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ING Electric Orange actually requires the overdraft line of credit, it&#8217;s not optional (at least, as of a couple months ago).  So they always do a hard credit inquiry.</p>
<p>I agree with the part about doing a hard inquiry for overdraft&#8230; though even then, they could wait until you actually make use of the overdraft.  I think banks like to do hard inquiries because they also offer mortgages; if they can artificially lower your credit score, they can charge you higher interest on a mortgage.</p>
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